I’ve already started to hear it from Giants fans and feel like I need to clarify what I think the upcoming Super Bowl means for Eli Manning. To start, it means a lot more to Eli than it does to Tom Brady in terms of their respective legacies. Tom will go down as one of the best in NFL history regardless; for him this game is about getting some revenge and securing his legacy as the best quarterback ever. For Eli, this game is all about validation. He’s already won a Super Bowl, but every quarterback must back up the first win with a second to claim their spot in history. And everybody remembers the fashion in which the his first Super Bowl was won.
I’ve stated that if the final minute of the 2007 Super Bowl shook out a little differently, or if Asante Samuel could actually catch the ball, then Eli Manning would be considered something of a chump with a major interception problem. First off, I said that before the playoffs began this year when Eli hadn’t reeled off the wins he has already this postseason – wins that are obviously helping to build his resume. Before this season though, Eli had played in the playoffs four times. Aside from his Super Bowl season in 2007, Eli’s other three playoff appearances resulted in a 0-3 record with 1 touchdown, 6 interceptions, and a quarterback rating of 54. As I said, without 2007 Eli is viewed as a chump.
I think that regardless of the outcome of this year’s Super Bowl, even the staunchest Eli-haters (me) will admit that he’s an improved quarterback, has shown he can do it in the 4th quarter, and he’s coming off his best season yet. There’s still plenty of issues with his game, but he’s not exactly the same Eli that we’ve been bashing for so long.
I don’t mean to trivialize the importance of the Super Bowl, I simply mean to say I think better of him already. But if he wants to take that next step, if he wants to actually make a name for himself, then he’s got the perfect opportunity in front of him on Super Bowl Sunday.
hey big boy, you started to hear it from giants fans when you wrote the eli vs tom what does it mean article.
To look at 10 games and to take the 3 worst and call the guy a chump is just silly, and he has 2 tds in those games not 1. in the 7, more then double, other games he has 14 touchdowns 2 picks and a 104 qb raiting, with 7 wins. I will let that speak for itself.
In the interest of fairness tommys worse three play off games has him at 4 tds, 8 picks, and a 60 qb rating, what a chump.
one other thing i found very interesting is that Tommy Terrific threw 1 touchdown pass in the 2001 playoffs. Uno, but yeah those superbowls were won on the back of the qb.
aaaaaand one more thing the qb rating that you hold so sacred, Eli playoff qb rating 87.5, Toms 87.6. Eli is such a chump.
Wait until the Patriots defense gets their hand on him!
to quote the great bart scott, can’t wait for new englands favorite groper to cover mario manningham.
Edelman is a boss, watch yourself.
If you read, I’m not discounting this year. My statement was made before the playoffs this year when in 4 posteseason appearances, Eli could not have been worse in 3 of them. That’s made very clear in the article.
if we are going into the past to knock people down what do you have to say about your big bad super bowl winning qb throwing 1 td pass in the entire 2001 playoffs?
Eli’s a good quarterback. He’s shown that this year. He’s been great in the clutch. Plus he’s already won a Super Bowl so he’s got nothing to prove. But the Giants are here because of their defense. Enough about Eli.
Including all those “chump” playoff numbers from Eli lets compare the playoff stats by career.
Eli- 16 TD(1.6/game), 8 INT(0.8/game), 222 yds/game, 89.62 QB rating (just took an average of all 10 games), 59.81 completion %
Tom- 36 TD(1.71/game), 19 INT(0.9/game), 239 yds/game, 89.35 QB rating, 62.77 completion %
WOW. ISN’T TOM JUST AMAZING. He has a worse TD/INT ratio, 17 yards per game more and a WORSE QB RATING! Not to mention how skewed these stats are with the Pats and their “I throw for no reason when up 35-10 and the game is over just to get Tom personal records” and his 6 TDs against the Broncos
when eli wins it doesnt count dan
Also slightly ironic is that if the Giants win this game (granted it is a big if at this point) then Eli and Tom have IDENTICAL playoff winning %’s
And if Eli wins, he’ll have 2 super bowls to Tom’s 3. Not to mention he’s missing the plethora of NFL records, the 16-0 regular season, the Uggs deal, etc.
That’s a good stat Fineeze (Tom is 16-5 presently, Eli is 7-3).
Postseason winning % would be the same, he would have 4 more years to catch up to Tom in the SB category, no cares about 16-0 because the only thing they see now is 18-1 (thanks to Eli)
Tom is also 4 years older, and threw 1 TOUCHDOWN PASS IN THE 2001 PLAYOFFS, THE ENTIRE PLAYOFFS 3 GAMES 1 TOUCHDOWN PASS.
Who cares about Uggs when you have Oreo, Direct TV, Citizen Watches, Reebok, and Toyota
Uggs = boss. Oreo is the only sponsor Eli has worth mentioning. As far as being 4 years older, is Eli going to have 16 playoff wins 4 years from now? And only 5 losses?
Dunno, could he get a super bowl or two?
Wait, I am confused. We aren’t actually debating whether or not Eli is as good as Tom Brady right?
Even the staunchest Giants honk can’t say that. Look at any stats you want – you can manipulate them any possible way to make your argument look better.
For example I could look back to the NFC Championship game and talk about how Eli had 8 mins left in the game and 3 possessions but couldn’t convert on any of them – to win the game. Then he had two more possessions in OT where he couldnt get them down the field to score. You what Eli Manning did to “win” the 49ers game? He handed the ball off twice, took a knee, and then watched Tynes kick a gimme.
So while we (you really) debate who is better Eli or Tom just remember Tom Brady has never and will never go 0-5 with a championship game on the line to win it. His defense may give it up – but he sure as hell always comes through.
Good point. Eli essentially lost that game but was saved by the fumble. Tom Brady, on the other hand, dove like a real athlete into the end zone for the go-ahead touchdown.
HHAHAHAHAHAHAA. Eli and his numbers vs the number 1 defense in football “essentially lost the game” but Tom Terrific and his whopping ZERO td’s and TWO int’s in the AFC championship game is really impressive. So was that 57.5 QB rating. Good call guys. What a joke Eli is with his TWO td’s and ZERO int’s and 82.3 QB rating against the best defense in football
Look at what happened with the game on the line, that’s what we’re talking about here. Eli came up blank, Tom dove into the endzone and scored a touchdown (so yes, he did have a touchdown just not a passing TD).
Yeah and his stellar 55% completion percentage. 32/58 – he was really on the mark.
He still couldn’t get it done when it counts. The only time he has got it done it took a miracle non call by the refs and miracle pass .
wait so eli gets no credit for this win and tom gets credit for throwing 1 td pass for the entire 2001 playoffs?
No, I’m not saying he gets no credit for the win. He played pretty good against the #1 defense in the league, but he did go quiet in crunch time.
punting in overtime is essentially losing the game? huh?
Sorry Williams the Giants have a more vertical passing attack. It isn’t dumpoff, dumpoff, slant, slant like amazing Tom’s. And when you play the #1 Defense in football and have 316yds, 2tds and 0 ints in the pouring rain and a muddy field then yes that is a good game.
Eli’s “steller” 55% completion percentage was 2 points lower than Tom’s QB rating.
tom brady in crunch time threw a pick and went three and out you muppets, and had to hold on for dear life while balls are being thrown in the endzone and kickers are shanking kicks from the 15 yard line.
the guy himself said I SUCKED. and somehow you guys cant see that
Im not arguing that he sucked. I am arguing that to say that you think Eli is as good or better than Tom Brady is ludicrous.
one, who said he was?
two, the playoff numbers are very comparable.
Except the most important stat which is Superbowls – which at age 31 Tom Brady had 3 Superbowl Championships, and 2 Superbowl MVPs.
It is interesting to hear you guys talk about stats – funny whenever Red Sox fans used to talk about stats you’d just say we have 26 Championships.
Championships don’t lie – Eli isn’t in the same stratosphere as Tom Brady
i think this is the 5th time i have brought this up but no one seems to care
one of those super bowls in 2001 Tom Terrific threw 1 touchdown pass, in the entire playoffs.
Super bowls are TEAM victories. If Adam Viniteri is Matt Stover or Ray Finkle you dont have that argument. If the defense was not as good as they were tom brady does not have three super bowls.
It is not like Tom said get on my back team I will lead you there, he went out and scored a total of 6 points in 2001, but lets make that the end all be all. Makes prefect sense
What is your point with the 1 touchdown?
You how many TD’s Eli threw to WIN the game last sunday? Zero.
Whether you want to admit it or not Superbowls are almost always won by quarterbacks. This is universally accepted. Just because it doesn’t fit your argument doesn’t make it untrue.
And do you remember the final drive in 2001? Yeah he pretty much did say get on my back. But I guess it doesn’t count because he didn’t throw enough touchdowns that postseason. For someone harping on team victories you sure are making a big deal out of an individual stat
my point is that the defense and kicker won that super bowl
the final drive in 2001
-10-NE 17 (1:21) (Shotgun) Tom Brady pass to J.R. Redmond to N.E. 22 for 5 yards (Dre’ Bly, London Fletcher). Pass 3, Run 2.
2-5-NE 22 (:57) (Shotgun) Tom Brady pass to J.R. Redmond to N.E. 30 for 8 yards (Aeneas Williams, Tommy Polley). Pass 3, Run 5.
1-10-NE 30 (:41) Tom Brady pass incomplete.
2-10-NE 30 (:41) (Shotgun) Tom Brady pass to J.R. Redmond pushed ob at N.E. 41 for 11 yards (Tommy Polley, Kim Herring). Pass 0, Run 11.
1-10-NE 41 (:33) (Shotgun) Tom Brady pass incomplete.
2-10-NE 41 (:29) (Shotgun) Tom Brady pass to Troy Brown ran ob at StL. 36 for 23 yards (Adam Archuleta). Pass 14, Run 9.
1-10-STL 36 (:21) (Shotgun) Tom Brady pass to Jermaine Wiggins to StL. 30 for 6 yards (Dexter McCleon, Leonard Little). Pass 1, Run 5.
2-4-STL 30 (:07) Tom Brady pass incomplete.
3-4-STL 30 (:07) Adam Vinatieri 48 yard field goal is GOOD. Center — Lonie Paxton. Holder — Ken Walter.
to summarize he threw the ball in the air for 21 of the 53 yards gained, sounds like the backs and receivers did most of that work. Even you could throw 4 swing passes and take one shot “deep” down field for a whopping 14 yards. and then viniteri comes in and drills a 48 yard field goal. GET ON MY BACK I WILL THROW THE BALL IN THE FLAT LIKE A MAN!
So Tom Brady didn’t throw the ball in the air far enough? Your ridiculous.
Someone should let him know that hes not a real quarterback unless he throws further down the field. Maybe he should stop letting his recievers run after the catch – instead maybe they should just kneel down exactly where they catch the ball
you cant say he said get on my back when he quickly dumped the ball off in the flat 4 times and they had to have the kicker kick an almost 50 yard field goal.
My point is his defense and kicker carried him in the entire 2001 playoffs and super bowl but that is the one stat that you boys keep pointing at.
Did he drive the ball down the field?
“Get on my back. I’ll throw it to Redmond and Wiggins!”. Amazing that he won with those guys. Let’s talk about 2012…
Any qb could have had that drive, he did nothing special, so yes he did but steve mcnair could still probably make some of those throws
Eli Manning has been to the playoffs 5 times in his career – Tom Brady has been to the Superbowl 5 times.
*Disclaimer: The Patriots have made the Superbowl 5 times with Tom Brady at Quarteback. They made it 3 times in spite of him and 2 times because of him
If that’s the case, why did he win Super Bowl MVP two years in which they made it in spite of him?
I’m not saying he didn’t perform in those superbowls. But he made it there 3 times due to his defense, not him.
I agree Dan. And Eli made it to his one Super Bowl because of his D. The difference is Tom did his thing 3 times, Eli did it once. Which, again, is what this article is saying – it’s Eli’s time to validate that one time. It’d be huge for him.
yet super bowl mvp eli manning is lucky and relied on his defense. Interesting the way that works.
Jbone how many times must I tell you. Read my post below as to when Pats win vs. when Giants win. Tom get credit and so does Giants D, not Eli
He WAS lucky – there is luck in any championship run/game. You can’t say he didnt get lucky.
With that said Eli has been great this year. He is no longer a joke – like Geoff and I used to think of him – hes legit. He scares me in this game – the Giants getting to the Superbowl is all about Eli – and little to do with the defense.
who hacked williams?
I think we all know Tom Brady is the better qb and no one is arguing he is not. What I think J Bone and Finoodle are trying to do is show that these guys are much more comparable in ability to lead their team to a championship than you Pats fans will acknowledge.
Also, you do refuse to see the importance of what the Pats teams did as a whole, not just Tom Brady did in their 3 championship seasons. While all you point to is the Gaints D and one “lucky” pass Eli had to win the superbowl in 07. If you go back and watch the run in those playoffs you would see, just like this year, that Eli is equally important to his teams, just as the Pats D is equally as important to his teams.
amen john boy.
If you gave me a Patriots team with a good defense a la the earlier Super Bowl era, I would literally bet my life on the game. Give me one of the worst defenses in NFL history, and I’m taking the Giants. It’s as simple as that. Tom is so much better because if you gave Eli a putrid defense, he wouldn’t be winning many games at all let alone contending for a Super Bowl.
that defense that is so putrid saved tom last week. he was awful, he admits he was awful, but if the pats win on sunday he becomes the greatest ever? That is why simply pointing at super bowls is silly.
by my count 27 qbs have won super bowls, by your guys logic they would be the 27 best qb’s ever. Trent Dilfer, Brad Johnson, Mark Rypien, and Jim McMahon are not even close to the top 100. It is just flawed logic.
I think that winning multiple Championships says a lot, do you disagree? My whole article was about QBs with one championship needing to validate it – this is Eli’s turn. You’re arguments are circling back to much of what I said in the article. This article is not Eli bashing if you read it for what it is and let your heart rate come down. It’s saying this is the chance he needs to seize.
“Aside from his Super Bowl season in 2007, Eli’s other three playoff appearances resulted in a 0-3 record with 1 touchdown, 6 interceptions, and a quarterback rating of 54. As I said, without 2007 Eli is viewed as a chump.”
is the line that i took exception with and up until a point was the conversation at hand as you can tell by reading my comments. someone took exception to eli and tom being in the same sentance and you jumped on his side.
no john. When the Patriots win its because of Tom. When the Giants win it is because of the Defense. Get with it Williams has very sounds logic. Since Eli threw 2 TD’s last week they don’t count since they weren’t in the last drive. Since Tom ran one in on their last drive just to watch Lee Evans drop a td and Cundiff miss a chip shot field goal but since he is Tom those things don’t matter and he won the game for them.
Tom didnt run one in on the last drive, he did with 11 minutes left, about the same time eli threw his last td in their game. The last two drives tom went three and out and threw a pick.
The Pats defense was huge, and I’d never deny that. I’d say Eli Manning has 33% of the ability of Brady to win championships at this point. If he wins this one, we’ll bump him up to 66%. That is not “comparable ability” in my eyes. He’s working on getting there, and as I’ve suggested, a win in this Super Bowl is a big step.
I don’t disagree with any of that
Eli had one of the most putrid defenses in the league all year, just behind the Pats, and lead his team to 9 wins and a playoff berth, where they finally put it all together. Granted this is not 13 wins, but again no one is sayin he is better than Tom. Again you refuse to acknowledge his ability to lead a team in big games. Just turn on any sport network or news program this week and listen to what they are saying. Many of them have been saying that right now he is playing better than Brady. That is from guys like Trent Dilfer and Tony Dungy, names I trust a little more when it comes to football knowledge than Mr. Howigit, sorry to discredit you here on your own blog, but I will take these guys words over yours any day when it comes to quarterback play.
dont forget super scout williams
SUPER SCOUT!
The Giants defense did struggle this year, but as you know (I heard all your whining) injuries had a lot to do with that. The Giants have an excellent defense (pass rush mostly) whereas the Patriots do not. I think you would agree.
I can listen to Trent Dilfer or Tony Dungy just as you can – feel free to read the articles they right as opposed to this site if you like. They are also two guys who have pretty much mocked Eli throughout his career, and all of a sudden he’s playing well and is the flavor of the hour.
I must of missed all those guys mocking eli for all these years, that seems to be your territory.
The Giants in no way have an excellent defense. They have a great front four and a horrible secondary.
Of course after last weekend no one will say Brady is playing better than Eli – he didn’t last week – but he did the week before.
take this for what it is
last 5 games
Eli 12 TD 2 INT 104 QB rating against teams with a total 54-26 record
Brady 12 TD 3 INT 102 QB rating 40-40 record against
*4 picks for Brady
So it’s Bradys fault his schedule has been easy? Not sure your point – your not making an argument for who’s better on a 5 game sample, right?
No one is saying that, no one has ever said that. Not yet atleast.
My point was more to people saying eli is better right now is not based on last week or two weeks, however recently he has.
both qbs are extremely mockable, tom brady is better, eli is getting better. Both are unlikeable for completely different reasons that generally have nothing to do with football.
just a thought some one mentioned how brady throws lots of dump offs into the flat but there have been many many short passes to cruz as of late that ended with him breaking off for a 100 yd td so that goes both ways (as do basically all of these arguments)
i think we can all just settle on the fact that Matt Moore is the qb of the future and Eli and Brady would be lucky if they got to hold his jock
i cant think of two of cruzes long touchdowns, one vs the jets was like a 14 yarder in the air, and for brady in his super bowl that is a bomb, and the seahawks one the ball probably traveled 30 yards in the air.
tim does matt moore like milk as much as you do?
“I’ve stated that if the final minute of the 2007 Super Bowl shook out a little differently, or if Asante Samuel could actually catch the ball, then Eli Manning would be considered something of a chump with a major interception problem.”
I have stated had it not been for some stupid rule Tom Brady would have been a never was. Take away the tuck rule, Brady loses and probably never heard from again. As I said without the tuck rule Brady would not even be a chump, he would have been a never was. No QB has benefited more from if, and, or buts than Brady. That game can be played with any QB
No Super Bowl game can be played with any QB – that’s a pretty ridiculous statement. And the tuck rule was what it was, but a rule is a rule. We’re not trying to change any rules here for Eli.
i think his point is to say well if asante can catch blah blah blah is the same thing as saying the tuck rule. yet for some reason Eli is lucky and relies on his defense and tom is tommy 3 super bowls.
and as far as him winning the super bowl with any qb I agree, go look at the great final drive above, any qb can throw the ball in the flat 4 times.
mr. jayjayjj50 who is your team?
Mark Sanchez
a matty kiiiiiiiiiiid showing!